Centris 650 Debian 10 SID Installation

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Re: Aranym installation, was Re: Centris 650 Debian 10 SID Installation

Finn Thain
On Fri, 21 Jun 2019, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:

> On 6/21/19 3:36 PM, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:
> > Forking hundreds of shell instances for doing simple things like
> > string substitution isn't efficient. It's a brain-dead design. Anyone
> > who thinks that sysvinit is the original Unix design has never used an
> > original Unix. sysvinit has always been a hack.
>
> And, FWIW, I recommend reading the "Unix Hater's Handbook" [1] for
> anyone who is still convinced the "old traditional Unix way" (TM) is the
> way to go. It isn't. Original Unix sucks. I have used HP-UX, OSF/1 and
> old versions of Solaris and they are all horrible to use.
>

I agree -- UNIX is to blame here. To be specific, the PID 1 heirarchy of
processes and its implications for the user/kernel boundary is broken.

Therefore, the main problem with sysvinit is also the main problem with
systemd.

--

> Adrian
>
> > [1] https://web.mit.edu/~simsong/www/ugh.pdf
>
>

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Re: Aranym installation, was Re: Centris 650 Debian 10 SID Installation

Finn Thain
In reply to this post by John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
On Fri, 21 Jun 2019, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:

> Feel free to report a bug against the src:debian-installer package so
> that such a change gets incorporated.

Bug reporting by invitation? Can I get one too? ;-)

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Re: Aranym installation, was Re: Centris 650 Debian 10 SID Installation

Finn Thain
In reply to this post by John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
On Fri, 21 Jun 2019, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:

>
> > When I see systemd taking several minutes to do something relatively
> > simple like adding swap, that doesn't strike me as particularly
> > efficient, especially on older, slower systems.
>
> It runs perfectly fine on my Amiga 4000/060/50 MHz.
>

Why anyone would claim that a burden which cripples a 25 MHz machine is
"perfectly fine" for a rare 50 MHz system is beyond me.

If your system hasn't been crippled yet, that's great, but the writing is
on the wall. It is disingenuous of you to pretend otherwise.

--

> Adrian
>
>

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Re: Aranym installation, was Re: Centris 650 Debian 10 SID Installation

Finn Thain
In reply to this post by John Paul Adrian Glaubitz
On Fri, 21 Jun 2019, John Paul Adrian Glaubitz wrote:

> I would think that no one would argue that a modern laptop, smartphone
> or smart TV is the same as a DEC3000 running OSF/1 in a local network.

And yet, Linux/mips supports both DECstation 5000 and Lemote Yeeloong.

> The latter doesn't know anything about dynamic networks, hardware and
> power management, but the former do. systemd supports dynamic changes,
> sysvinit does not. It's an absolute no-brainer what to use in 2019.
>

2019? Now you're reaching. How about 2038?

For the record, if you want dynamic changes on your Amiga or DECstation,
your options aren't limited to just systemd. You can get that from openrc.

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