Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

bw-2
>Bw, 9.7.2019 14:13 +0200:
>
>    In-Reply-To: <[????] [hidden email]>
>
>Could you please stop this nonsense? You break every thread you
>participate in. "In-Reply-To" is a message *header* field and as such
>(surprise!) belongs into the header section of the message and not into
>it's body, where you insist on putting it.
>
>Again: please stop this nonsense!

No Problem, Sorry To Offend... how's this look to ya?

I would subscribe, but there is a lot of (pointless) mail and I have
limited bandwidth.  Until broadband is lower than my electric bill I am stuck with
500MB per month.

Maybe you could spam/filter out my address permanently?

L8r,
bw
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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

Reco
        Hi.

On Tue, Jul 09, 2019 at 11:36:14AM -0400, bw wrote:

> >Bw, 9.7.2019 14:13 +0200:
> >
> >    In-Reply-To: <[????] [hidden email]>
> >
> >Could you please stop this nonsense? You break every thread you
> >participate in. "In-Reply-To" is a message *header* field and as such
> >(surprise!) belongs into the header section of the message and not into
> >it's body, where you insist on putting it.
> >
> >Again: please stop this nonsense!
>
> No Problem, Sorry To Offend... how's this look to ya?

Much better. Please keep it this way from now on, many of the readers of
this list will appreciate it. Helps with the archive's consistency.

ktnxbye,
Reco

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

Tixy-2
In reply to this post by bw-2
On Tue, 2019-07-09 at 11:36 -0400, bw wrote:

> > Bw, 9.7.2019 14:13 +0200:
> >
> >    In-Reply-To: <[????] [hidden email]>
> >
> > Could you please stop this nonsense? You break every thread you
> > participate in. "In-Reply-To" is a message *header* field and as
> > such
> > (surprise!) belongs into the header section of the message and not
> > into
> > it's body, where you insist on putting it.
> >
> > Again: please stop this nonsense!
>
> No Problem, Sorry To Offend... how's this look to ya?

Still broken because there is no 'In-Reply-To' or 'References' email
header. You've just removed it from the body text. (I'm not the person
who complained this time but I did in the past.)

--
Tixy


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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

Reco
        Hi.

On Tue, Jul 09, 2019 at 05:14:13PM +0100, Tixy wrote:

> On Tue, 2019-07-09 at 11:36 -0400, bw wrote:
> > > Bw, 9.7.2019 14:13 +0200:
> > >
> > >    In-Reply-To: <[????] [hidden email]>
> > >
> > > Could you please stop this nonsense? You break every thread you
> > > participate in. "In-Reply-To" is a message *header* field and as
> > > such
> > > (surprise!) belongs into the header section of the message and not
> > > into
> > > it's body, where you insist on putting it.
> > >
> > > Again: please stop this nonsense!
> >
> > No Problem, Sorry To Offend... how's this look to ya?
>
> Still broken because there is no 'In-Reply-To' or 'References' email
> header. You've just removed it from the body text. (I'm not the person
> who complained this time but I did in the past.)

I see it in that e-mail:

In-Reply-To: <[hidden email]>

You mean you got the e-mail without it?


PS There's no References indeed.

Reco

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster)

kdall99
In reply to this post by bw-2
Bw, 9.7.2019 17:36 +0200:

 > No Problem, Sorry To Offend... how's this look to ya?

Hm, not sending an In-Reply-To header at all doesn't help - you've just
started *another* new thread.
Put In-Reply-To in the message header where it belongs. Then - and only
then - it will enable the mail clients of all the subscribers of this
list to automatically know to which posting you replied to.

 > I would subscribe, but there is a lot of (pointless) mail and I have
 > limited bandwidth.  Until broadband is lower than my electric bill I
am stuck with
 > 500MB per month.

OK, understood. But does the limitation *you* have to live with justify
that you break threads for *all other* members of the list?

Maybe you could resume doing what you did 'till Oct 2018, when you did
put the In-Reply-To header where it belongs:
<https://lists.debian.org/msgid-search/alpine.DEB.2.20.1810192036590.7736@debian>

 > Maybe you could spam/filter out my address permanently?

I could. But that would only help if no one ever replied to one of your
replies. With every single one of you replies you create a new thread -
regardless if I see it's root or filter it - since you've detached the
(sub-)thread from it's origin.

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

bw-2
In reply to this post by bw-2

>Still broken because there is no 'In-Reply-To' or 'References' email
>header. You've just removed it from the body text. (I'm not the person
>who complained this time but I did in the past.)
>
>--
>Tixy

Yeah I agree it's broken.  It's definitely time I figured out how to
rewrite or use custom headers when calling alpine with the list mailto:
link but it might take me a minute.

I sure don't want to annoy any further, and I'll need to figure out a good
way to test any changes I make instead of using the list.

Any tips welcome, gripes not so much, but it's all good.

What's the idea behind references and in-reply-to?  Which or both are the
right way to go?

Found this old link, sounds complicated.
http://www.ii.com/internet/messaging/pine/changing_from/

In the meantime, tell Markos @
https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2019/07/msg00573.html
about bugs 842422, 835553 ok?

L8r,
bw

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

Tixy-2
In reply to this post by Reco
On Tue, 2019-07-09 at 19:21 +0300, Reco wrote:
> Hi.
>
> On Tue, Jul 09, 2019 at 05:14:13PM +0100, Tixy wrote:
[...]

> > Still broken because there is no 'In-Reply-To' or 'References'
> > email
> > header. You've just removed it from the body text. (I'm not the
> > person
> > who complained this time but I did in the past.)
>
> I see it in that e-mail:
>
> In-Reply-To: <[hidden email]>
>
> You mean you got the e-mail without it?

Correct, no In-Reply-To in the email I got, and the lists archives
don't show it as a reply to any other post...
https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2019/07/msg00584.html

And threaded list here shows it as a new top level post
https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2019/07/thrd2.html

--
Tixy

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

Dominik George-7
In reply to this post by bw-2
>What's the idea behind references and in-reply-to?  Which or both are
>the
>right way to go?
>
>Found this old link, sounds complicated.
>http://www.ii.com/internet/messaging/pine/changing_from/
>
>In the meantime, tell Markos @
>https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2019/07/msg00573.html
>about bugs 842422, 835553 ok?

Normally, it's sufficient to use a decent mailer instead of a toy or ancient Greek fax machine.

-nik

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

Reco
        Hi.

On Tue, Jul 09, 2019 at 09:28:29PM +0200, Dominik George wrote:

> >What's the idea behind references and in-reply-to?  Which or both are
> >the
> >right way to go?
> >
> >Found this old link, sounds complicated.
> >http://www.ii.com/internet/messaging/pine/changing_from/
> >
> >In the meantime, tell Markos @
> >https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2019/07/msg00573.html
> >about bugs 842422, 835553 ok?
>
> Normally, it's sufficient to use a decent mailer instead of a toy or ancient Greek fax machine.

> User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android

LOL. One who lives in the glass house should not throw stones.

Reco

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

bw-2
In reply to this post by Dominik George-7


On Tue, 9 Jul 2019, Dominik George wrote:

> >What's the idea behind references and in-reply-to?  Which or both are
> >the
> >right way to go?
> >
> >Found this old link, sounds complicated.
> >http://www.ii.com/internet/messaging/pine/changing_from/
> >
> >In the meantime, tell Markos @
> >https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/2019/07/msg00573.html
> >about bugs 842422, 835553 ok?
>
> Normally, it's sufficient to use a decent mailer instead of a toy or
> ancient Greek fax machine.
>
> -nik
>

You mean a windows-clone email client?  haha, yeah right.  I fart in your
general direction.

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

Greg Wooledge
In reply to this post by Reco
On Tue, Jul 09, 2019 at 10:33:02PM +0300, Reco wrote:
> On Tue, Jul 09, 2019 at 09:28:29PM +0200, Dominik George wrote:
> > Normally, it's sufficient to use a decent mailer instead of a toy or ancient Greek fax machine.
>
> > User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android
>
> LOL. One who lives in the glass house should not throw stones.

And yet... Dominik's mail has valid In-Reply-To: and References: headers.
Seems like some pretty good glass.

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

Curt
In reply to this post by bw-2
On 2019-07-09, bw <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>> Normally, it's sufficient to use a decent mailer instead of a toy or
>> ancient Greek fax machine.
>>
>> -nik
>>
>
> You mean a windows-clone email client?  haha, yeah right.  I fart in your
> general direction.
>

We are beginning to diverge here from the sound technical arguments and
sober, unemotional discourse for which this forum is renown.


--
"These findings demonstrate that under appropriate conditions the isolated,
intact large mammalian brain possesses an underappreciated capacity for
restoration of microcirculation and molecular and cellular activity after a
prolonged post-mortem interval." From a recent article in *Nature*. Holy shit.

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

bw-2
In reply to this post by bw-2
>We are beginning to diverge here from the sound technical arguments and
>sober, unemotional discourse for which this forum is renown.

Come on, that's just not true.  This list is full of crap and nobody even
knows wtf is up with whty alpine is broken this way, including me.  The
whole argument reminds me of the myth of the gnat and the camel...
https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/straining+at+a+gnat

I try to help a user swallow the camel, and get criticised for the
gnat in my email.

Anyway, it is a problem I'd love to solve with a mail client that works
from linux tty.

L8r,
bw

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

Eduardo M KALINOWSKI-4
In reply to this post by bw-2

On 9 de julho de 2019 11:36, bw wrote:
> I would subscribe, but there is a lot of (pointless) mail and I have
> limited bandwidth.  Until broadband is lower than my electric bill I am stuck with
> 500MB per month.

Any decent mail client should be able to download only metadata for messages (subject, etc), which is minimal amounts of data, and only fetching the actual bodies of the ones you want.

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

Charlie Kravetz-2
In reply to this post by bw-2
On Tue, 9 Jul 2019 16:33:39 -0400 (EDT)
bw <[hidden email]> wrote:

>>We are beginning to diverge here from the sound technical arguments and
>>sober, unemotional discourse for which this forum is renown.  
>
>Come on, that's just not true.  This list is full of crap and nobody even
>knows wtf is up with whty alpine is broken this way, including me.  The
>whole argument reminds me of the myth of the gnat and the camel...
>https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/straining+at+a+gnat
>
>I try to help a user swallow the camel, and get criticised for the
>gnat in my email.
>
>Anyway, it is a problem I'd love to solve with a mail client that works
>from linux tty.
>
>L8r,
>bw
>

Claws-mail works very good for mailing lists. It is a linux mail
reader, now also for windows.

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

Linux-Fan
In reply to this post by bw-2
bw writes:

> >We are beginning to diverge here from the sound technical arguments and
> >sober, unemotional discourse for which this forum is renown.
>
> Come on, that's just not true.  This list is full of crap and nobody even
> knows wtf is up with whty alpine is broken this way, including me.  The
> whole argument reminds me of the myth of the gnat and the camel...
> https://idioms.thefreedictionary.com/straining+at+a+gnat
>
> I try to help a user swallow the camel, and get criticised for the
> gnat in my email.
>
> Anyway, it is a problem I'd love to solve with a mail client that works
> from linux tty.
Cone works well for me, although it is unfortunately not in Debian anymore.
See http://www.courier-mta.org/cone/ to find out if it may suit your needs.

HTH
Linux-Fan

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

Dan Purgert
In reply to this post by Greg Wooledge
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA256

Greg Wooledge wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 09, 2019 at 10:33:02PM +0300, Reco wrote:
>> On Tue, Jul 09, 2019 at 09:28:29PM +0200, Dominik George wrote:
>> > Normally, it's sufficient to use a decent mailer instead of a toy
>> > or ancient Greek fax machine.
>>
>> > User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android
>>
>> LOL. One who lives in the glass house should not throw stones.
>
> And yet... Dominik's mail has valid In-Reply-To: and References: headers.
> Seems like some pretty good glass.

Must've gotten it from Corning.

But then again, glass is silly strong, just a bit brittle.


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--
|_|O|_|
|_|_|O| Github: https://github.com/dpurgert
|O|O|O| PGP: 05CA 9A50 3F2E 1335 4DC5  4AEE 8E11 DDF3 1279 A281

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

andreimpopescu
In reply to this post by bw-2
On Ma, 09 iul 19, 16:33:39, bw wrote:
>
> Anyway, it is a problem I'd love to solve with a mail client that works
> from linux tty.

I'm quite surprised neo/mutt was not mentioned already.

Kind regards,
Andrei
--
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

andreimpopescu
In reply to this post by Eduardo M KALINOWSKI-4
On Ma, 09 iul 19, 16:53:40, Eduardo M KALINOWSKI wrote:
>
> On 9 de julho de 2019 11:36, bw wrote:
> > I would subscribe, but there is a lot of (pointless) mail and I have
> > limited bandwidth.  Until broadband is lower than my electric bill I am stuck with
> > 500MB per month.
>
> Any decent mail client should be able to download only metadata for
> messages (subject, etc), which is minimal amounts of data, and only
> fetching the actual bodies of the ones you want.
 
That sounds very much like IMAP, which I'm using as well with
imapfilter, neomutt and a GMX account dedicated to receiving list e-mail
only (virtually spam-free, knock on wood).

Gmail also offers IMAP, but their... unique implementation requires
special handling in neo/mutt.

Kind regards,
Andrei
--
http://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

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Re: please stop breaking threads (was: Problem Installing DiscoveryStudio2019 in Buster

Reco
In reply to this post by Greg Wooledge
        Hi.

On Tue, Jul 09, 2019 at 04:14:07PM -0400, Greg Wooledge wrote:

> On Tue, Jul 09, 2019 at 10:33:02PM +0300, Reco wrote:
> > On Tue, Jul 09, 2019 at 09:28:29PM +0200, Dominik George wrote:
> > > Normally, it's sufficient to use a decent mailer instead of a toy or ancient Greek fax machine.
> >
> > > User-Agent: K-9 Mail for Android
> >
> > LOL. One who lives in the glass house should not throw stones.
>
> And yet... Dominik's mail has valid In-Reply-To: and References: headers.
> Seems like some pretty good glass.

I agree that K-9 is a sane e-mail client in this regard. Does not make
it "decent" and does not remove "toy" status from it.

Reco

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