Re: speakup/espeakup/debian installer

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Re: speakup/espeakup/debian installer

Samuel Thibault-8
Hello,

Please always keep the mailing list in Cc, so that I am not the only
recipient of the mail. Writing to me only means risking falling in
the middle of my vacations and thus not getting an answer for weeks,
or that I just don't have the time to answer and thus you would at
best get a terse answer, or worse, no answer at all... Conversely,
keeping the list in Cc means avoiding all these issues completely,
you'll involve all the community to help you, make the answers you
get available to everyone, and even archived for web crawlers to find
them whenever somebody has the same issue.

Terry D. Cudney, le ven. 03 mai 2019 11:31:23 -0400, a ecrit:
>       On initial boot of the installer, speakup comes up talking, as expected. However, speech is not interrupted by keyboard input. When it comes to the hard drive setup/formatting speakup keeps chattering away, endlessly, making the installation process impossible.

That's very surprising, I'm not getting that issue.  Which CD image did
you use exactly?

Samuel

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Re: speakup/espeakup/debian installer

Jude DaShiell-3
I routinely pause espeak using the less than key before disk formatting
happens since I prefer to do an install from the numbered menu and the
reason for that is to log install and move question priority from 3 to 4
so I can have the installer put the non-free packages in for me and
eventually execute a shell to set up wi-fi networking post-install.
Since I now have a cat5 line installed use of wi-fi for the computer is
no longer necessary but the other adjustments for me remain desireable.

On Sun, 19 May 2019, Samuel Thibault wrote:

> Date: Sun, 19 May 2019 16:59:26
> From: Samuel Thibault <[hidden email]>
> To: Terry D. Cudney <[hidden email]>
> Cc: [hidden email]
> Subject: Re: speakup/espeakup/debian installer
> Resent-Date: Sun, 19 May 2019 20:59:41 +0000 (UTC)
> Resent-From: [hidden email]
>
> Hello,
>
> Please always keep the mailing list in Cc, so that I am not the only
> recipient of the mail. Writing to me only means risking falling in
> the middle of my vacations and thus not getting an answer for weeks,
> or that I just don't have the time to answer and thus you would at
> best get a terse answer, or worse, no answer at all... Conversely,
> keeping the list in Cc means avoiding all these issues completely,
> you'll involve all the community to help you, make the answers you
> get available to everyone, and even archived for web crawlers to find
> them whenever somebody has the same issue.
>
> Terry D. Cudney, le ven. 03 mai 2019 11:31:23 -0400, a ecrit:
> >       On initial boot of the installer, speakup comes up talking, as expected. However, speech is not interrupted by keyboard input. When it comes to the hard drive setup/formatting speakup keeps chattering away, endlessly, making the installation process impossible.
>
> That's very surprising, I'm not getting that issue.  Which CD image did
> you use exactly?
>
> Samuel
>
>

--

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Re: speakup/espeakup/debian installer

Didier Spaier
In reply to this post by Samuel Thibault-8
Hello,

which keys do you use to interrupt speech?

Best,

Didier

On 19/05/2019 22:59, Samuel Thibault wrote:

> Hello,
>
> Please always keep the mailing list in Cc, so that I am not the only
> recipient of the mail. Writing to me only means risking falling in
> the middle of my vacations and thus not getting an answer for weeks,
> or that I just don't have the time to answer and thus you would at
> best get a terse answer, or worse, no answer at all... Conversely,
> keeping the list in Cc means avoiding all these issues completely,
> you'll involve all the community to help you, make the answers you
> get available to everyone, and even archived for web crawlers to find
> them whenever somebody has the same issue.
>
> Terry D. Cudney, le ven. 03 mai 2019 11:31:23 -0400, a ecrit:
>>       On initial boot of the installer, speakup comes up talking, as expected. However, speech is not interrupted by keyboard input. When it comes to the hard drive setup/formatting speakup keeps chattering away, endlessly, making the installation process impossible.
>
> That's very surprising, I'm not getting that issue.  Which CD image did
> you use exactly?
>
> Samuel
>
>

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Re: speakup/espeakup/debian installer

Terry D. Cudney-4
In reply to this post by Samuel Thibault-8
Hello,

        The installer image I used was:

        debian-stretch-DI-rc4-amd64-netinst.iso

        installing on a single core amd64 machine with a usb flash drive.

        curiously, I have installed the newest "raspian" (derivative of debian) on a raspberry pi with similar behaviour. from speakup/espeakup after the installation.

        In this case the installation is done by dd-ing the image onto the micro-sd card, putting the SD card into the raspberry pi and booting, then completing the setup (installing espeakup) via ssh from another machine. Then when logged in to the raspian/raspberry pi speakup is active/working well except that the speech is not interrupted by keyboard input, similar to the behaviour experienced with the debian installer.

        i.e. when speakup is set to read a longer section of text, perhaps a screenful, nothing will stop/interrupt the speech until speakup has finished vocalizing the entire sectionof text. This is very difficult (impossible) to work with.

        I just noticed a new version of the debian installer for the amd64. Perhaps this will have eliminated this awkward behaviour? But, I think the problem lies with the speakup/espeakup code, not with the debian installer.

        Any observations/workarounds/solutions out there?

        TIA,

        ---terry
       
On Sun, May 19, 2019 at 10:59:26PM +0200, Samuel Thibault wrote:
--> Hello,
-->
--> Please always keep the mailing list in Cc, so that I am not the only
--> recipient of the mail. Writing to me only means risking falling in
--> the middle of my vacations and thus not getting an answer for weeks,
--> or that I just don't have the time to answer and thus you would at
--> best get a terse answer, or worse, no answer at all... Conversely,
--> keeping the list in Cc means avoiding all these issues completely,
--> you'll involve all the community to help you, make the answers you
--> get available to everyone, and even archived for web crawlers to find
--> them whenever somebody has the same issue.
-->
--> Terry D. Cudney, le ven. 03 mai 2019 11:31:23 -0400, a ecrit:
--> >       On initial boot of the installer, speakup comes up talking, as expected. However, speech is not interrupted by keyboard input. When it comes to the hard drive setup/formatting speakup keeps chattering away, endlessly, making the installation process impossible.
-->
--> That's very surprising, I'm not getting that issue.  Which CD image did
--> you use exactly?
-->
--> Samuel

--
Name: Terry D. Cudney
Phone: 289-488-4882 ext 1
E-mail: [hidden email]

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Re: speakup/espeakup/debian installer

Terry D. Cudney-4
In reply to this post by Didier Spaier
Hi,

        Historically, >ANY< key press should interrupt speech output.

        --terry
       
On Sun, May 19, 2019 at 11:16:51PM +0200, Didier Spaier wrote:
--> Hello,
-->
--> which keys do you use to interrupt speech?
-->
--> Best,
-->
--> Didier
-->
--> On 19/05/2019 22:59, Samuel Thibault wrote:
--> > Hello,
--> >
--> > Please always keep the mailing list in Cc, so that I am not the only
--> > recipient of the mail. Writing to me only means risking falling in
--> > the middle of my vacations and thus not getting an answer for weeks,
--> > or that I just don't have the time to answer and thus you would at
--> > best get a terse answer, or worse, no answer at all... Conversely,
--> > keeping the list in Cc means avoiding all these issues completely,
--> > you'll involve all the community to help you, make the answers you
--> > get available to everyone, and even archived for web crawlers to find
--> > them whenever somebody has the same issue.
--> >
--> > Terry D. Cudney, le ven. 03 mai 2019 11:31:23 -0400, a ecrit:
--> >>       On initial boot of the installer, speakup comes up talking, as expected. However, speech is not interrupted by keyboard input. When it comes to the hard drive setup/formatting speakup keeps chattering away, endlessly, making the installation process impossible.
--> >
--> > That's very surprising, I'm not getting that issue.  Which CD image did
--> > you use exactly?
--> >
--> > Samuel
--> >
--> >

--
Name: Terry D. Cudney
Phone: 289-488-4882 ext 1
E-mail: [hidden email]

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Re: speakup/espeakup/debian installer

Samuel Thibault-8
In reply to this post by Terry D. Cudney-4
Hello,

Terry D. Cudney, le dim. 19 mai 2019 19:38:17 -0400, a ecrit:
> Any observations/workarounds/solutions out there?

As Didier asked: which keys do you use to try to interrupt speech? Which
kind of keyboard are you using, connected which way?

samuel

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Re: speakup/espeakup/debian installer

Samuel Thibault-8
Samuel Thibault, le lun. 20 mai 2019 08:20:26 +0200, a ecrit:
> Terry D. Cudney, le dim. 19 mai 2019 19:38:17 -0400, a ecrit:
> > Any observations/workarounds/solutions out there?
>
> As Didier asked: which keys do you use to try to interrupt speech?

Ok, in another mail you answered, I then guess you tried all kinds of
keys.

> Which kind of keyboard are you using, connected which way?

This, however, could be important to answer.

Samuel

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Re: speakup/espeakup/debian installer

Terry D. Cudney-4
Hello,

    Yes, I have tried all key possibilities to interrupt speech, to no avail.

    Initially, I was using a standard 104-key ps-2 keyboard, but I have tried a 104-key USB-connected keyboard and more recently on my Asus laptop withthe integrated keyboard. The results are the same, no matter which keyboard was being used.

    I might add, that these computer/keyboard combinations have worked flawlessly with previous versions of the debian installer, running-debian and with raspian on the Pie.

    The problem is only with more recent versions of speakup/espeakup, in the debian installer and raspian. I don't know about speakup/espeakup in other distributions.

    As I described in a previous post, I did the complete installation of raspian on the pie (the installer is not needed there) and the behaviour where key presses do not interrupt speakup/espeakup is the same. as experienced in the debian installer.

    On a side note, I have spoken with Kirk Reiser, one of the original developers of speakup. He informed me that this behaviour began at leat 1.5 years ago. Kirk's experience is similar, but a bit different to mine. On his machine speakup does respond to key presses, but the response is only after an unacceptable delay. He, as a workaround, replaces the /usr/bin/espeakup installed by the current debian release, with a copy of the /usr/bin/espeakup from an older release. Doing this, speakup responds to keyboard input immediately.

    From these observations it would seem that there was some change made  to the espeakup code 1.5-2 years ago that produces this unacceptable lag in, or lack of, response to key presses.

    Samuel, can you ascertain what changed in the espeakup  code about 1.5 to 2 years ago, that could cause this?

    Thanks,

    --terry
   



On Mon, May 20, 2019 at 08:23:01AM +0200, Samuel Thibault wrote:
--> Samuel Thibault, le lun. 20 mai 2019 08:20:26 +0200, a ecrit:
--> > Terry D. Cudney, le dim. 19 mai 2019 19:38:17 -0400, a ecrit:
--> > > Any observations/workarounds/solutions out there?
--> >
--> > As Didier asked: which keys do you use to try to interrupt speech?
-->
--> Ok, in another mail you answered, I then guess you tried all kinds of
--> keys.
-->
--> > Which kind of keyboard are you using, connected which way?
-->
--> This, however, could be important to answer.
-->
--> Samuel

--
Name: Terry D. Cudney
Phone: 289-488-4882 ext 1
E-mail: [hidden email]

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Re: speakup/espeakup/debian installer

Samuel Thibault-8
Terry D. Cudney, le lun. 20 mai 2019 13:47:08 -0400, a ecrit:
>     Samuel, can you ascertain what changed in the espeakup  code about 1.5 to 2 years ago, that could cause this?

That's a long period of time, at best I could suggest the switch to
espeak-ng, or to pulseaudio.

Samuel

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Re: speakup/espeakup/debian installer

Didier Spaier
In reply to this post by Terry D. Cudney-4
Hello,

if the output of following command:
cat /sys/accessibility/speakup/no_interrupt
is just: 1
try this:
echo 0 > /sys/accessibility/speakup/no_interrupt

Best,

Didier

On 20/05/2019 19:47, Terry D. Cudney wrote:

> Hello,
>
>     Yes, I have tried all key possibilities to interrupt speech, to no avail.
>
>     Initially, I was using a standard 104-key ps-2 keyboard, but I have tried a 104-key USB-connected keyboard and more recently on my Asus laptop withthe integrated keyboard. The results are the same, no matter which keyboard was being used.
>
>     I might add, that these computer/keyboard combinations have worked flawlessly with previous versions of the debian installer, running-debian and with raspian on the Pie.
>
>     The problem is only with more recent versions of speakup/espeakup, in the debian installer and raspian. I don't know about speakup/espeakup in other distributions.
>
>     As I described in a previous post, I did the complete installation of raspian on the pie (the installer is not needed there) and the behaviour where key presses do not interrupt speakup/espeakup is the same. as experienced in the debian installer.
>
>     On a side note, I have spoken with Kirk Reiser, one of the original developers of speakup. He informed me that this behaviour began at leat 1.5 years ago. Kirk's experience is similar, but a bit different to mine. On his machine speakup does respond to key presses, but the response is only after an unacceptable delay. He, as a workaround, replaces the /usr/bin/espeakup installed by the current debian release, with a copy of the /usr/bin/espeakup from an older release. Doing this, speakup responds to keyboard input immediately.
>
>     From these observations it would seem that there was some change made  to the espeakup code 1.5-2 years ago that produces this unacceptable lag in, or lack of, response to key presses.
>
>     Samuel, can you ascertain what changed in the espeakup  code about 1.5 to 2 years ago, that could cause this?
>
>     Thanks,
>
>     --terry
>    
>
>
>
> On Mon, May 20, 2019 at 08:23:01AM +0200, Samuel Thibault wrote:
> --> Samuel Thibault, le lun. 20 mai 2019 08:20:26 +0200, a ecrit:
> --> > Terry D. Cudney, le dim. 19 mai 2019 19:38:17 -0400, a ecrit:
> --> > > Any observations/workarounds/solutions out there?
> --> >
> --> > As Didier asked: which keys do you use to try to interrupt speech?
> -->
> --> Ok, in another mail you answered, I then guess you tried all kinds of
> --> keys.
> -->
> --> > Which kind of keyboard are you using, connected which way?
> -->
> --> This, however, could be important to answer.
> -->
> --> Samuel
>

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Fwd: speakup/espeakup/debian installer

Didier Spaier
Message re-sent to the list (previous had a wrong address)


-------- Forwarded Message --------

Hello,

if the output of following command:
cat /sys/accessibility/speakup/no_interrupt
is just: 1
try this:
echo 0 > /sys/accessibility/speakup/no_interrupt

Best,

Didier

On 20/05/2019 19:47, Terry D. Cudney wrote:

> Hello,
>
>     Yes, I have tried all key possibilities to interrupt speech, to no avail.
>
>     Initially, I was using a standard 104-key ps-2 keyboard, but I have tried a 104-key USB-connected keyboard and more recently on my Asus laptop withthe integrated keyboard. The results are the same, no matter which keyboard was being used.
>
>     I might add, that these computer/keyboard combinations have worked flawlessly with previous versions of the debian installer, running-debian and with raspian on the Pie.
>
>     The problem is only with more recent versions of speakup/espeakup, in the debian installer and raspian. I don't know about speakup/espeakup in other distributions.
>
>     As I described in a previous post, I did the complete installation of raspian on the pie (the installer is not needed there) and the behaviour where key presses do not interrupt speakup/espeakup is the same. as experienced in the debian installer.
>
>     On a side note, I have spoken with Kirk Reiser, one of the original developers of speakup. He informed me that this behaviour began at leat 1.5 years ago. Kirk's experience is similar, but a bit different to mine. On his machine speakup does respond to key presses, but the response is only after an unacceptable delay. He, as a workaround, replaces the /usr/bin/espeakup installed by the current debian release, with a copy of the /usr/bin/espeakup from an older release. Doing this, speakup responds to keyboard input immediately.
>
>     From these observations it would seem that there was some change made  to the espeakup code 1.5-2 years ago that produces this unacceptable lag in, or lack of, response to key presses.
>
>     Samuel, can you ascertain what changed in the espeakup  code about 1.5 to 2 years ago, that could cause this?
>
>     Thanks,
>
>     --terry
>    
>
>
>
> On Mon, May 20, 2019 at 08:23:01AM +0200, Samuel Thibault wrote:
> --> Samuel Thibault, le lun. 20 mai 2019 08:20:26 +0200, a ecrit:
> --> > Terry D. Cudney, le dim. 19 mai 2019 19:38:17 -0400, a ecrit:
> --> > > Any observations/workarounds/solutions out there?
> --> >
> --> > As Didier asked: which keys do you use to try to interrupt speech?
> -->
> --> Ok, in another mail you answered, I then guess you tried all kinds of
> --> keys.
> -->
> --> > Which kind of keyboard are you using, connected which way?
> -->
> --> This, however, could be important to answer.
> -->
> --> Samuel
>

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Re: speakup/espeakup/debian installer

Terry D. Cudney-5
In reply to this post by Samuel Thibault-8
Hi,

        How would one switch  this in the installer?

        TIA,

        --terry
       
       
Samuel wrote:
Terry D. Cudney, le lun. 20 mai 2019 13:47:08 -0400, a ecrit:
>     Samuel, can you ascertain what changed in the espeakup  code about 1.5 to 2 years
+ago, that could cause this?

That's a long period of time, at best I could suggest the switch to
espeak-ng, or to pulseaudio.