Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

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Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

deb-12
Hello folks:


Again, for someone trying to pull Windows (and Mac) users into Linux ...

Are there list-suggested ways to help verify non-free /
out-of-stable-distro or even seldomly updated in-distro tools, PRE-INSTALL?


A portion of the users are going to have the ability to sudo apt-get
install ....

No way around that.

I have them (at least) do this first:


  * $ apt-cache search the-thing  # shows variants

  * $ apt-cache show the-thing     # Let's them see more, pre-install

  * https://startpage.com the-thing

  * talk to me.                                # gives me a chance to
brace myself.



Are there suggested sites to look up Linux tools to verify them a bit;
rather than just one-off searches?

Are there suggested sites where KNOWN BAD tools are listed?


Thanks again





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Re: Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

bw-2
in-reply-to=<[hidden email]>

>Are there list-suggested ways to help verify non-free /
>out-of-stable-distro or even seldomly updated in-distro tools,
>PRE-INSTALL?

Well... that's a deep subject.  You mention three different categories of
pkgs, but I think many people would say there are only two main
categories:

"in-repo" and "out-of-repo"

Everything in the repo has a bug page at bugs.debian.org/<pkgname> and
also a page at packages.debian.org/<pkgname>

"out-of-repo" stuff, well... again that's a deep subject.  Not enough
time.  If you want to pull win users into linux, start them off right.  
They don't need to all be administrators, do they?  If you just want to
let them trash the system and play around that's cool.  Make an hourly
backup.

Some suggested reading here to get started.  
https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian

I think this forum is a good place to read first, post later.  The
archives have a ton of info. Many issues have already been done to death.
https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/
https://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser

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Re: Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

deb-12

On 3/22/19 3:14 PM, bw wrote:

> in-reply-to=<[hidden email]>
>
>> Are there list-suggested ways to help verify non-free /
>> out-of-stable-distro or even seldomly updated in-distro tools,
>> PRE-INSTALL?
> Well... that's a deep subject.  You mention three different categories of
> pkgs, but I think many people would say there are only two main
> categories:
>
> "in-repo" and "out-of-repo"
>
> Everything in the repo has a bug page at bugs.debian.org/<pkgname> and
> also a page at packages.debian.org/<pkgname>
>
> "out-of-repo" stuff, well... again that's a deep subject.  Not enough
> time.  If you want to pull win users into linux, start them off right.
> They don't need to all be administrators, do they?  If you just want to
> let them trash the system and play around that's cool.  Make an hourly
> backup.

They won't all be admins, but the top tech folks will be.

(But, those are likely the ones who will cause the most trouble).


One thing they do do is backup.

Lots and lots of backups.


I will add the bug list check to my list (good idea).


>
> Some suggested reading here to get started.
> https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian
>
> I think this forum is a good place to read first, post later.  The
> archives have a ton of info. Many issues have already been done to death.
> https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/
> https://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser
>
Thank you bw!

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Re: Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

Nicholas Geovanis-2
On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 2:52 PM deb <[hidden email]> wrote:

They won't all be admins, but the top tech folks will be.
(But, those are likely the ones who will cause the most trouble).

Do you know how to "disable" select administrative commands using /etc/sudoers?
It can be useful in these situations. Your top tech folks can defeat it.

One thing they do do is backup.

Lots and lots of backups.


I will add the bug list check to my list (good idea).


>
> Some suggested reading here to get started.
> https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian
>
> I think this forum is a good place to read first, post later.  The
> archives have a ton of info. Many issues have already been done to death.
> https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/
> https://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser
>
Thank you bw!

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Re: Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

andy smith-10
In reply to this post by deb-12
Hello,

On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 11:44:15AM -0400, deb wrote:
> Are there list-suggested ways to help verify non-free / out-of-stable-distro
> or even seldomly updated in-distro tools, PRE-INSTALL?

If in your /etc/apt/sources.list you stick to one distribution and
don't include "contrib" and "non-free" suites then you aren't going
to get any non-free software and the packages you install will at
least have been considered acceptable by Debian for release.

> Are there suggested sites to look up Linux tools to verify them a bit;
> rather than just one-off searches?
>
> Are there suggested sites where KNOWN BAD tools are listed?

That all sounds highly subjective and don't see how you could have
any such definitive thing.

There is no substitute for proper research but as a blunt tool, once
you have identified multiple different packages that do what you
want you could look at Debian's popcon to compare how many reported
installations there are of each of them:

    https://popcon.debian.org/

Cheers,
Andy

--
https://bitfolk.com/ -- No-nonsense VPS hosting

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Re: Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

deb-12

On 3/22/19 7:43 PM, Andy Smith wrote:

> Hello,
>
> On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 11:44:15AM -0400, deb wrote:
>> Are there list-suggested ways to help verify non-free / out-of-stable-distro
>> or even seldomly updated in-distro tools, PRE-INSTALL?
> If in your /etc/apt/sources.list you stick to one distribution and
> don't include "contrib" and "non-free" suites then you aren't going
> to get any non-free software and the packages you install will at
> least have been considered acceptable by Debian for release.
>
>> Are there suggested sites to look up Linux tools to verify them a bit;
>> rather than just one-off searches?
>>
>> Are there suggested sites where KNOWN BAD tools are listed?
> That all sounds highly subjective and don't see how you could have
> any such definitive thing.
>
> There is no substitute for proper research but as a blunt tool, once
> you have identified multiple different packages that do what you
> want you could look at Debian's popcon to compare how many reported
> installations there are of each of them:
>
>      https://popcon.debian.org/
>
> Cheers,
> Andy
>

This popcorn page looks useful Andy!

https://qa.debian.org/popcon.php?package=iotop


Thank you -- I did not know about that one.


This gets added to my little list of things to check with.


Thanks!



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Re: Ways to verify tools/applications? Fire support for new users

deb-12
In reply to this post by Nicholas Geovanis-2


On 3/22/19 4:22 PM, Nicholas Geovanis wrote:
On Fri, Mar 22, 2019 at 2:52 PM deb <[hidden email]> wrote:

They won't all be admins, but the top tech folks will be.
(But, those are likely the ones who will cause the most trouble).

Do you know how to "disable" select administrative commands using /etc/sudoers?
It can be useful in these situations. Your top tech folks can defeat it.


Yes, but I am A admin, these other folks will demand sudo privileges to even think about Linux.

Not optimal, I know.

Thanks Nicholas!



One thing they do do is backup.

Lots and lots of backups.


I will add the bug list check to my list (good idea).


>
> Some suggested reading here to get started.
> https://wiki.debian.org/DontBreakDebian
>
> I think this forum is a good place to read first, post later.  The
> archives have a ton of info. Many issues have already been done to death.
> https://lists.debian.org/debian-user/
> https://wiki.debian.org/FAQsFromDebianUser
>
Thank you bw!